I have chucked 4 pieces of wood into my new lathe and have managed to throw them all across the garage.......
Twice while trying to turn shanks (one of which caught and threw a chunk of briar right by my ear) and twice while turning the bowl. I have used spindle gouges and a easy wood tools rougher. Am I getting too agressive with my cuts? I thought I was going really light, but maybe I'm not. I am turning right around 2000 rpm or so.
I think I will give Anthony Harris at Acme Pipes a call tomorrow. He is the only guy I know of who makes pipes here in Kansas City.
MANNNNN.....am I frustrated. Back to the sander and drill press for now...
Am I Calamity Jane or Annie Oakley??...depends on the day. www.ladybriar.com
It is a Oneway chuck with Tower Jaws...basically Kurt's setup. I have a varialbe speed lathe, 300-3000 rpm or so. I am tightening the chuck as much as I can. My husband actually tightened the chuck the first time, so I don't think that's the problem.
Am I Calamity Jane or Annie Oakley??...depends on the day. www.ladybriar.com
You have to tighten the chuck with BOTH the holes it has for the chuck key. Alternate which holes you use and tighten one, then the other, then the first, then the other again. If you don't do this (with almost any keyed chuck) it isn't tight. You cannot tighten a chuck with any amount of pressure in a single keyhole.
The other possibility is that your cutting tools are not as sharp as you think and they are grabbing the wood and blammo. They need to be super razor sharp - fresh from the grindstone sharp.
Sounds like you're starting with the block and roughing down -- this is a very tricky thing to do with hand tools. First thing, tool rest as close as possible to the work. Get as close to the centerline as possible with your tool. Above it won't bite, but too far below gives the work too much mechanical advantage and kerpow. Second, don't use a gouge for roughing, use a heavy scraper. The scraper edge won't dig in and launch like a gouge, and the bigger the tool, the less chatter and the more control. Third, take very very small bites. It takes time to gain the control you need to avoid poking the tool in just a little too far and having it become a lever. Again, kerpow.
Keep at it. Maybe wear a full face shield for a while.
Just my opinion, but don't slow the lathe down. The faster, the smoother. I run my metal lathe off a freq drive so I can crank it up for turning.
I turned the lathe down a bit. I did get a bowl turned, but the tear out is really bad. The easy turning rougher I have is super sharp. I did notice that it seemed to bounce on the wood. Am I not holding it tight enought to keep it from jumping around. The lathe is level...my husband did.
Also, when you turn a bent pipe do you need to lay it out higher on the block so you have plenty of wood (on the bottom) to get into the chuck (when you turn the shank)?
My husband won't let me anywhere near the lathe without a face shield on, he's known me too long...I really am Calamity Jane
Am I Calamity Jane or Annie Oakley??...depends on the day. www.ladybriar.com
Align the mortise, use a forstner, drill the mortise and switch the tailstock to a live center, press it and lock it against mortise hole.
You can start working on the shank at 1000-1200rpm with gouges and after you get it almost round, you can remove the live center and work it as you want.
I second Jack's advice. Sounds like your letting your tool get below the centerline and not stabilizing it enough. Don't let it bounce. And for God's sake be careful.
Have never had a piece of briar come out, you must not have it tight enough. I use the less expensive oneway, no key tightening, but the two bar tightening. Have never had an issue with the block coming out. And I just use regular tower jaws, nothing special, but I sure as hell lock it down.
But I do get chatter, but that is, I fear, because I'm just not very experienced on the lathe. I have been roughing them at a much slower speed, but I know that I would get a cleaner, smoother cut at a higher speed, I'm just scared silly to do it at a high speed as a mistake at a high speed is a REAL mistake, or so it seems to me.
My goal over the next few weeks is to practice my turning, get my hands used to the feel of what should be happening. I may even take a turning class at the local Woodcraft so as to get the basics. I also bought a video, which helped some.
And then learn how to sharpen my tools, not there yet.
Damn, so many things to learn!
But, seriously, wear a full face mask. Damn, a piece of briar coming off at 2,000 or more rpms is quite the harmful missile!
The slower the speed, the more time per rev the tool has to poke in too far. Faster speed gives smoother cut and better finish.
It's a nice thing about a metal lathe, though -- for roughing you get to use the cross slide and compound, and you can't poke the tool in unless you turn the crank too fast. But the key is still speed. Maybe if a block launches it will be traveling faster, but I would balance that against the increased possibility of a launch at slow speed.
One other thing, slice off as much extra material with the bandsaw before turning. The shank, for instance -- no reason not to chop it down at least to a square cross-section.
JHowell wrote:The slower the speed, the more time per rev the tool has to poke in too far. Faster speed gives smoother cut and better finish.
It's a nice thing about a metal lathe, though -- for roughing you get to use the cross slide and compound, and you can't poke the tool in unless you turn the crank too fast. But the key is still speed. Maybe if a block launches it will be traveling faster, but I would balance that against the increased possibility of a launch at slow speed.
One other thing, slice off as much extra material with the bandsaw before turning. The shank, for instance -- no reason not to chop it down at least to a square cross-section.
I, very helpfully, agree with Jack. When shaping, I'm turning as fast as my lathe will go. Much smoother.
JHowell wrote:The slower the speed, the more time per rev the tool has to poke in too far. Faster speed gives smoother cut and better finish.
It's a nice thing about a metal lathe, though -- for roughing you get to use the cross slide and compound, and you can't poke the tool in unless you turn the crank too fast. But the key is still speed. Maybe if a block launches it will be traveling faster, but I would balance that against the increased possibility of a launch at slow speed.
One other thing, slice off as much extra material with the bandsaw before turning. The shank, for instance -- no reason not to chop it down at least to a square cross-section.
I, very helpfully, agree with Jack. When shaping, I'm turning as fast as my lathe will go. Much smoother.
Hope this helps.
Rad
Seriously? Damn, will have to rethink my ways here. I don't have a metal lathe, just a wood lathe that will turn to almost 3400, do you go that high, even when roughing?
wmolaw wrote:
Seriously? Damn, will have to rethink my ways here. I don't have a metal lathe, just a wood lathe that will turn to almost 3400, do you go that high, even when roughing?
If your lathe can handle it without walking all over the place or shaking to death. As pipe makers we have to deal with turning everything out of balance. For that reason we have to turn slower than other woodturners might. There's a reason they make big heavy wood lathes: fast is good.
My rule of thumb when it comes to pipe making is turn fast, drill slow.
JHowell wrote:The slower the speed, the more time per rev the tool has to poke in too far. Faster speed gives smoother cut and better finish.
It's a nice thing about a metal lathe, though -- for roughing you get to use the cross slide and compound, and you can't poke the tool in unless you turn the crank too fast. But the key is still speed. Maybe if a block launches it will be traveling faster, but I would balance that against the increased possibility of a launch at slow speed.
One other thing, slice off as much extra material with the bandsaw before turning. The shank, for instance -- no reason not to chop it down at least to a square cross-section.
I, very helpfully, agree with Jack. When shaping, I'm turning as fast as my lathe will go. Much smoother.
Hope this helps.
Rad
I'm glad someone else does it this way too. I was beginning to wonder if I was alone on this one. I turn my lathe on the absolute highest speed when I'm cutting this way. Mind you, I still take very small cuts. But between higher and lower speeds, I get a much better cut on a higher speed.
I'm sure there's a great scientific reason for this, but spinning really fast makes it smoother. Maybe it's because the bulk of the block is coming around so much faster and more often that you don't have as much time to hit the lower parts of the block and get stuck when the bulk comes back around and your tool is too deep.
This way also increases the danger, so you still have to be very careful.
Also, if you don't keep your tool flat parallel it can get sucked down and that's going to break something almost every time.
Don't take this as "advice" because I probably use this tool way wrong. But, I use the side of this type of gouge to do all my rough shaping.
Running the motor at 90Hz with a frequency drive, I reckon I'm about 2000 rpm. Could go higher on the spindle but the countershaft is on plain bearings. I'd go faster if I thought the countershaft would take it. Lathe is fairly heavy and rigid, 2-jaw chuck is probably close to 20lbs. by itself, no problems with vibration.
wmolaw wrote:
Seriously? Damn, will have to rethink my ways here. I don't have a metal lathe, just a wood lathe that will turn to almost 3400, do you go that high, even when roughing?
If your lathe can handle it without walking all over the place or shaking to death. As pipe makers we have to deal with turning everything out of balance. For that reason we have to turn slower than other woodturners might. There's a reason they make big heavy wood lathes: fast is good.
My rule of thumb when it comes to pipe making is turn fast, drill slow.
Will have to alter my ways. Many times, when the block is turning slowly I get more vibration than if I put it up a few hundred more rpms. And I have been trying to drill at slower rpms, so as not to burn the wood.
I just need practice, and lots of advice! Thanks, will go fast next time and see what I see.
Given my lack of ability, I assure you I will also wear a face mask. Would a kevlar vest be too much?
Well, here is my best guess (pictures would really help).
I use a bowl gouge for rough turning for a couple of reasons.
One, it is a very sturdy tool and gives me a lot of stability.
Two, it is very versatile. You can take roughing cuts with it and then use a different presentation to take very fine finishing cuts.
When roughing down a piece or turning a piece that is not chucked at the center (most of pipe turning) you have to be very careful about where your cut is
and how much briar is hanging out of the cut radius. You may be going along just fine with your roughing cut, trying to keep it straight, and allow yourself
to get too close to the headstock (where you haven't roughed down enough) and end up taking much bigger cuts than you intended, thus causing a catch.
While doing your rough cut you can learn to watch the shadow of the uncut part of the wood to make sure you are not getting too close. Or you may need
to stop the lathe frequently to make sure you know where you are with respect to those edges.
The key is to know where the rough edges are and take very small cuts until you have a radius to rest the tool on.
Also, I have not used an Easy Wood Tool, but I would be very afraid to use a scrapper for rough turning. My opinion is that a scrapper would be much more prone to a catch than a gouge.
I recommend using a heavy gouge (maybe a 1/2" bowl gouge or spindle gouge). DON'T USE A ROUGHING GOUGE! IF YOU GET A BIG CATCH THEY CAN BREAK AND CAUSE INJURY.
Also, as Sas pointed out, keeping your tools razor sharp is very important as well. You will take lighter cuts and not push as hard.
wmolaw wrote:
Given my lack of ability, I assure you I will also wear a face mask. Would a kevlar vest be too much?
My van is about 3 feet behind me in the garage, I have thought about putting bubble wrap around it before I turn the lathe on. I have found that the blocks tend to be thrown down and kind of behind the lathe...at least that's what happens when I get a catch. So I'm not too worried about being hit. I've taken a 60 mph rise ball in the ribs playing softball, I'm sure I'll survive if a chunk of wood gets me. I know the ultimate goal is to not be hit at all because the wood is staying in the chuck
Am I Calamity Jane or Annie Oakley??...depends on the day. www.ladybriar.com
