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[Gatorade]

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[ToddJohnson]

Hi Dave,

Your local leather shop (provided you have a local leather shop) will probably be able to work up a pattern/design for pipe bags. Or you can always bring your own pattern and just give it to him/her to use. When you order in small quantities expect to pay about $10-$12 per bag. If the pipe cost more than $100, and you want to continue making and selling pipes with good reputation, don't ship it in bubble wrap.

Something else you may be interested in doing is procuring some Ultraleather which, though more expensive/sq. ft. than actual leather, can be purchased by the yard and used from edge to edge--no holes, no scars with stitches, no blemishes, etc. It can also be sewn on a regular home sewing machine with relative ease and does not require an industrial machine. So you or your wife/partner/roomate/neighbor can easily produce the bags yourself.

Hope this helps.

Best,

Todd

[ToddJohnson]

There are dozens or hundreds of approaches, probably one for each pipemaker.

What I do is buy a chamois at a drugstore or auto store, cut off a pipe-sized chunk, wrap the pipe in it, and tie it with a leather thong. It's purpose is to protect the pipe from scratches and dings, not to give the recipient a big thrill... I sell pipes not socks or boxes, and I think fancy packaging is silly. Of course I am not the most successful guy in this business so my opinion counts for little or nothing.

The "purpose" of a pipe bag is to allow for the pipe to be easily transported without getting scratched or dinged. If however the pipe is worthy of the truck dashboard or floorboard, a bag is probably not necessary. Most people who buy artisan pipes are part of the hobby, which means that pipes go back and forth to shows, club meetings, etc. The presentation of a pipe in a nicely tailored pipe bag is not a one time thing. Each time a collector reaches for that pipe and slides it either into and out of a leather pipe sock, or ties it up in a car towel, that reflects something of the maker. You may consider it silly pretense, but presentation is important and probably not something you want to snub your nose at. I think Jody Davis probably has the best presentation of any artisan I know right now.

I would suggest that you give some thought to the matter because in a way you are setting a precedent for later on... just don't make it too important and give yourself an ulcer over it. <g>

There is a vast spectrum of presentation vs quality to choose from... one guy may use the prettiest presentation case on the planet to encase a TOS, another guy may wrap a beautiful pipe in rags; there is a level of contrast in everything.

I've seen the latter happen with ugly results. More often than not though what happens is that a sloppy pipe is presented in a pedestrian manner and a quality pipe is presented in a quality manner. Many customers, whether you consider this fair or not, will make this connection at the outset.

Todd

[ArtGuy]

Anyone know a good source for boxes? I am having trouble finding somewhere I can get lidded boxes the size that most pipes come in.

[Tyler]

I ship my pipes in a leather sock that my wife makes for them, and that in a handgun case. The hand gun case is nice because it can be used to haul about 6 pipes around to vacation or the local pipe club meeting.

Tyler

[KurtHuhn]

I think I should present it in something and I would like to send it in like a chamois bag but I have no idea where to buy them.

What do you pros use and where do you get it?

My wife makes all my bags for me. She uses a crushed velvet exterior, and an ultra-soft satin interior with a drawstring. I'm looking at moving to chamois or something else though - it wil ltake less time for her to make, and be more in line with what folks expect when buying a pipe from an artisan. That Ultraleather sounds good, Todd, thanks for pointing that out.

I like the gun case idea too. Those usually aren't too much money, but are bound to give the customer a great big warm and fuzzy feeling.

[joshl]

ToddJohnson wrote:

Each time a collector reaches for that pipe and slides it either into and out of a leather pipe sock, or ties it up in a car towel, that reflects something of the maker. You may consider it silly pretense, but presentation is important and probably not something you want to snub your nose at.

I totally agree with you Todd. I have yet to sell any of my pipes (I'm trying to get a selection together for the K.C. show) But I'm already thinking about presentation. I would like to make a nice velvet lined wooden box for all of my pipes. Of course I'm not in this business to make money (yet). I just want to produce high quality pipes that make customers smile. And I believe that begins with the presentation of the pipe. Think about it this way: If you went to an extremely nice restraunt and ordered a very expensive meal would you be dissapointed if it was served on a cafeteria tray? I would. I know it always makes me feel better about spending the money for a high grade pipe when its presented with the same love and craftsmanship with which it was made.

[ToddJohnson]

I know little or nothing about those who purchase high-grades. If bragging rights are more important to them than quality of product, which is the way your post sounds, I am not sure quite what to think.

There are those who say that the clothes make the man; I have always held that the man makes the man and the clothes are useful for deceiving fools... silly me.

I'm not sure where you see any reference to "bragging rights" in my post, though it doesn't surprise me entirely. You seem to intimate quite often that a basically rustic and serviceable pipe is all an honest man really needs (or would want if it weren't for the overwhelming weight of peer pressure). Deep down, this is the type of pipe that people are attracted to, but they just want the frills of a high grade to impress their friends.

This is a simplistic and ill-informed perspective that paints my customers (and friends) as a bunch of pompous show-offs. You insult a number of very generous, kind, and sincere gentlemen with this sort of rhetoric. It's not all just a big conspiracy against the little guy, and the "old boys club" model that you seem to carry arround like a chip on your shoulder doesn't work. You should come out of your hole and meet some of these guys. If you did you would see that they're not just a hoard of elitest snobs wanting new toys to show off at the club. Everyone has their passions, be it food, or cars, or pipes. Sure you can always manage with a hamburger, a Toyota, and a Dr. Grabow, but it doesn't make you a snob if you choose something better than that. And if you order Steak au Poivre it shouldn't come to your table in a paper wrapper. If it does, it reflects poorly on the chef.

Todd

[Gatorade]

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[ToddJohnson]

I have no doubt lost you in miscommunication again <sigh>. Suffice it to say that if I wrap my pipes in old newspapers smelling of fish, and the purchaser thinks ill of the pipe because of the packaging, that is not the person I am trying to reach.

The pipe may stand on its own merits, whether wrapped in fish-smelling newspaper or not, but that sort of packaging reflects poorly on the maker if nothing else. The pipe may or may not be made with the same carelessness with which it was packaged and presented. One thing is sure however; the perception will be that you have no problem doing things in a sloppy and careless manner. Based on the presentation of the pipe, this perception would be perfectly justified. Such carelessness may or may not extend to the pipe's design, construction, and finishing, but you cannot blame *anyone* for inferring such. If you're looking to reach someone who doesn't mind paying a couple of hundred dollars for a pipe that comes wrapped in fish-smelling newspaper, good luck. I'm sure that guy is out there somewhere, but I wouldn't want to be the one who has to find him.

Todd

[Tyler]

I love it when a conversation takes off like this. I think we should require that random and Todd disagree in every thread so that the conversation really takes off and gets to the meat of the issue! Oh wait! They do that already. (Kidding of course. I love you guys! Group hug...Group hug...gather around.)

Here are my thoughts on presentation. I think it is VERY important. That is why I am willing to spend about $8-$10 everytime I ship out a pipe BEFORE I pay the shipping.

Lets be honest, every pipe ever made is a luxury good. No one NEEDS to smoke a pipe. As with all luxury items, we buy them because of the pleasure they bring us. And pipes, like other luxury items, come in varying degrees of luxury, in the sense that there are varying levels of quality, appearance, functionality, and price. The higher up we go in luxury level, the more we anticipate the pleasure will be for the item. Thus we are willing to pay the extra price.

Now then, when we move up the luxury level, one of the things that one expects is a quality presentation. One would not expect to have a Monet or Picasso sold at Christie's in a cardboard mailing tube. The value of the item brings an expectation of care and respect in its pacakging. Certainly valuable and rare paintings/documents are found in humble packaging, but that is remedied ASAP when discovered. Why? Because we want the item displayed as beautifully as possible and protected as much as possible.

Back to pipes, when someone buys a pipe from me, they are buying an experience, hopefully many of them as the enjoy the pipe over a lifetime. One of the experiences they are buying is the initial "introduction" to the pipe. What I want to happen is for a buyer to get to the post office and say, "Whoa! What a big box for one pipe." Then I want them to see that I spent $10 shipping it and charged them nothing. Then I want them to open the box and say, "Wow, what a cool case!" Then I want them to open the case and see the leather sock and say, "I comes with a sock too? Nice." Then I want them to reach into the sock, pull out the pipe, and not be able to speak at all. That is what I want. I call that presentation. And here is the great thing, such an experience seems to be something people want to buy. I almost always have customers e-mail me after receiving their pipe wanting to make arrangements for their next one, and they almost always comment on the packaging. They love it.

Does that mean you can't be awestruck by a pipe wrapped in tissue. Nope. It has happened to me actually. I won an eBay auction last year that included 4 pipes, one of which I new to be a Pre-Trans Barling based on e-mails I had with the seller. You could not tell this from the photos or the description. I won the auction for $36. When I got the package I was a brown paper envelope with a coffee can stuffed inside. Inside the coffee can, were four individually wrapped little bundles who's stems stuck about 1" above the rim of the can. When I unwrapped the first bundle I was awestruck by a Pre-Trans Barling that had been smoked once, maybe twice. I was still glossy from its initial buffing from the factory. Incredible. I sold it on eBay for $275, and that to a dealer who I'm sure got $400+ for it.

The difference between these two experiences is critical though, and it can be summarized with one word: expectation. When you drop $400, $500, $600...+++ on a pipe, you EXPECT to be awestruck. If you aren't, you are disappointed. When you spend $36, your expectation is minimal, and your awe is largely an issue of surprise. Part of being awestruck is presentation.

To sum up this long-winded opinion, the presentation is an extension of the product. I spend so much time making a pipe perfect that I cannot stand not to do the same with the presentation. For me, making a pipe is about the joy I get from its creation and the joy the owner gets from it qualities. I want that joy for the owner to start at the Post Office.

Tyler

[KurtHuhn]

Tyler, I think you pretty much summed it all up better than anyone to date. *And*, you and Todd have both made me rethink how I package pipes for shipment. Apparently, this is an oft-overlooked part of being a pipemaker with aspirations of success.

Thank you both for explaining this small, but *very* important detail.

Time to re-think my packaging....

[ToddJohnson]

You are (at least in my opinion) successful at what you are doing and that includes the way you are doing it. However there is almost always more than one way to skin a cat.

Skin away then. As always, best of luck with that.

Todd