OK, it's time for another ShitStorm thread

[LatakiaLover]

I'll just jump straight into it, since there's no diplomatic way to broach the subject.

I've watched a number of higher level carvers knock out pipes similar to this design on a 40 grit wheel in an astonishingly short time. Minutes. No lines, no drawings, no measuring, no protractors, no tape, no calipers, no rulers. Nothing but eyeballs and a plain, bright background or window to hold the emerging stummel up to.

So, is this REALLY how some carvers make their stuff, or is it just flash & fluff drawn up after the fact to impress customers? (translation: "justify" a higher price)

http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/m ... -pic-heavy

[W.Pastuch]

I guess it's fine to do it that way, the problem is the pipe that came out looks nothing like the one it was based on... So a lot of wasted pencil lead

[sandahlpipe]

It seems from the pictures that he was commissioned to copy a pipe exactly. I don't know how you could be exact with the copy if you're not planning it out first. And it just makes sense to me that you'd plan it out in drawings, especially if the shape you're copying isn't in your repertoire already. Once I've done a shape a few times (for me, that's a billiard) I just draw lines for drilling and eyeball the shape. But if I had to do this shape exactly, I'd need to use the drawings. But I'm also not a "higher level carver" and maybe it's different for them.

[scotties22]

So, is this REALLY how some carvers make their stuff, or is it just flash & fluff drawn up after the fact to impress customers? (translation: "justify" a higher price)

Do you mean all the reference lines and shit drawn all over the stummel? I can only assume it so the pictures look good? Even if it is a pipe I am making from pictures I wouldn't draw that much on the block as a reference as I'm carving. Again, I would refer to the picture (and drawing all over the picture is something I have been known to do...a lot), or pictures as I go.

But....like Mr. Sandcastle said.......I'm not a high level carver either, so what the hell do I know?

[LatakiaLover]

Do you mean all the reference lines and shit drawn all over the stummel?

I meant the entire production. The whole "blueprints and technical drawings" array.

If a program was being written for a CNC machine you'd probably need something like that to code from, but for a regular pipe?

I can't believe the guy produces OR needs all that stuff as a regular part of his process, or if he does, that he makes more than minimum wage (if that) from carving pipes.

[scotties22]

I really don't know. I think it looks like a whole lot of extra work...for me anyway.

[mightysmurf8201]

If it's the first time doing a particular shape, I'll take my time drawing it out a few different ways and measuring lengths and angles and such, but I've never been that meticulous. I've only ever drawn on one side of the block just for profile and drilling angles.
As a side note, there is something to the whole flash and fluff thing. I'm not saying that it's the case here, but just yesterday I posted a sketch of an author, and I had a guy comment that I could charge more for my pipes if I included the sketches with each pipe. I told him the sketches were for my benefit and I like to keep them for reference and adjustments later. He responded by saying that I could just make a copy for myself and send off the original and that when he buys a pipe from me, he's gonna want the sketch to hang up in his study. We'll see. I'm not sure I want to set a precedence that people are going to expect every time I make a pipe.

[Sasquatch]

When you are making exact copies, it's certainly nice to have some distinct points of reference. I've had situations where someone wanted a replica of their favorite pipe, down to pretty exacting measurements, shank size (diamters and length), stem, bowl diameter.. all of it. It's not too easy and obviously the briar has to help you too.

I don't know that having things written down in mm helps a hell of a lot, as soon as you cut in that's lost.... whatever. I'll tell Mike you think his pipe sucks next time I see him, George!

[kamkiel]

I say good for him! It looks like he made the commissioned pipe process really interactive. The customer wanted a diplomat that was inspired by Dunhill, not a dunhill diplomat. The pipemaker in the post is known for his billiard family of pipes, right? I imagine that making a diplomat might have been out of his comfort zone, and more lines on the block helped him from turning the piece into a bent brandy or apple. Besides all of that, we all know that everyone has their own process while shaping a pipe.

I recall seeing pictures of a pipe show that had auctioned off some Iverson blueprint. I think having some memorabilia: tamper, blueprint, bag/box, even stickers and shirts, is becoming the "norm". Maybe all of this was started by dunhill with their limited edition pipes that included certificate, tamper, and fancy packaging. At least it appears that way to me.

Before, it was possible to just being super excited to recieve a pipe from your favorite maker that was made for you, but maybe nowadays, having a one pipe set of stuff is what makes people think its worth it. When I become super famous master pipe maker, I will also had them a garbage bag full of cutoffs, briar dust and stem material that came from making your pipe!

Joking aside, you have a very satisfied customer who is likely to come back. On top of that, customer also has a unique story to tell at pipe meets about how their particular pipe was made (with proof).

As for my rambling above… I haven't drank enough coffee yet this morning.

Kiel

[calsbeek]

IAWK
You all are being douchey just to be douchey (and thats two uses of a word that ain't even a word). The guy made a pipe that made someone happy. Why do you care how he did it? Could you do it better? Maybe. Does it matter? Not to his happy customer.

also I'm two beers in

[Tyler]

Can we presume that everyone does it the same way? I saw that post yesterday. As an engineer who interacts constantly with other engineers, I thought as I saw those photos, "I know lots of people who do things that way. Glad I don't!"

I doubt it's fluff. Why waste the time? I'd be stunned if that brings customers. That was Michael Parks after all. I doubt he's scratching around for work.

[PremalChheda]

I believe it comes down to a natural sculpture skill. Some got it, some don't. I do not have it. I have to go the mechanical approach.

[kamkiel]

IAWK
You all are being douchey just to be douchey (and thats two uses of a word that ain't even a word). The guy made a pipe that made someone happy. Why do you care how he did it? Could you do it better? Maybe. Does it matter? Not to his happy customer.

also I'm two beers in

One of my secrets to get people to agree with me is to feed them beer.

Honestly, I was just thinking out loud.

[Sasquatch]

That was Michael Parks after all. I doubt he's scratching around for work.

Yeah he's an artiste, so he gets to write as much shit on the block as he likes.

[Sasquatch]

I better let him know I'm trashin' him behind his back...

[Ocelot55]

I think the level of detail is sometimes directly correlated to the "pickyness" of the customer. (I'm not making a direct assertion in this particular case.)

I can make a diplomat no problem, no real measuring required, just eyeball it all. But what I can't do is guarantee my accuracy will be +-.1" Having had commissioned pipes rejected because they were off by a tenth of an inch is an extremely frustrating experience. Was some of the layout for show? Sure. Maybe. But if the customer was one of those rare gems that breaks out the calipers to inspect the work I'll bet every precaution was taken to make sure they were pleased. And, after all, if someone is going to spend $1000+ on a pipe they're probably entitled to break out the calipers if they want.

[Ocelot55]

I'll just jump straight into it, since there's no diplomatic way to broach the subject.

I just saw what you did there George. Very "punny" since the pipe in question is a diplomat!

[Joe Hinkle Pipes]

I know a guy that has been making high level pipes for 15 years, and his routine is very similar to what is shown. Outline, measurements, reference lines, everything. On almost every pipe.

[caskwith]

Depends on the pipe, rarely do I go into that much detail, mostly I just draw the shape on the side, mark drilling lines and have at it. If there are specific design points such as bands, filters, special stems etc then I will of course make some notes and measurements for those but mostly it's done by eye.

[pipedreamer]

I make reference lines here and there, so I don't do something stupid like cute shank off...