Your first sale

[Spit'n'Whittle]

I must admit, I picked up this great hobby on a bit of a whim. I had no intention of really doing a lot of selling of pipes. I really had more of a vision of a fun hobby that allowed me to utilize my creative side and maybe give a few to friends and family.

I'm in a spot now where I literally have more people trying to place "orders" than I can deal with. Completely unsolicited! I started smoking my 3rd pipe at work and people started inquiring. I just bought the bit for properly cutting out the tobacco bowl last week for crying out loud. I've had pretty good results and have seen vast improvement in my pipe craft with the generous help of this forum but I just don't know if I'm ready for this.
I have a grand total of 14 pipes under my belt. That's it.

How long did some of you guys wait until you actually started to actively sell? Overwhelming

[sandahlpipe]

I didn't wait long enough before I started selling. I've had to work at recovering my reputation and regret several of my early pipes floating around out there that wouldn't make the cut anymore. It would be ideal to wait until you have made a few dozen and make sure you're really happy with your work before you sell. You can't take back something you put your name on.

Having said that, I sold like my 5th pipe I made. I sold most through my YouTube channel early on. I should have kept them or sold them for the cost of materials for the first year and a half, but couldn't resist people asking me to make them pipes.

[Spit'n'Whittle]

That's exactly what I'm afraid of. I'm just not confident enough yet to make a commitment under contract of sale and deliver. I do like the idea, though of selling at material cost until I get more experience under my belt and properly set up for that matter.

[Massis]

I agree with Jeremiah, although I'd like to add that it might depend on who you're selling to.

In my case, my earliest pipes (and heck, I'm only around 20 pipes right now...) were "sold" to members of the dutch pipesmoking forum in exchange for another pipe they no longer wanted or a tin of tobacco. They knew they were getting a pipe made by someone new to the craft and had seen at least one other pipe I had made (which was TONS worse). And I have to say that to this day they are still happy customers who will by new ones made by me. Even if the earlier ones weren't as pretty or well finished, if the mouthpiece is comfortable, the drilling is done decently and they smoke well, people will be happy because they get what they wanted (as they can see what the pipe looks like in advance).

Jeremiah also has a point saying you can't take something back you put your name on. That's why to this day I haven't stamped a single pipe. I will only start stamping them once I feel they deserve to be. A few of the last pipes I made might still get a stamp in the future, but only 2 or 3 orso, not the others.

[caskwith]

Deciding when/if to sell is something only you can do really, and probably the biggest factor is who you are selling to. Selling a pip to your best buddy or your brother in law is a lot different than selling a pipe to random guy on an internet forum or someone you met at the local tobacconist.

I started selling after only a couple of pipes (number 3 maybe) but then I had the advantage of working with another pipe maker who could tell me straight whether it was acceptable, you will have to make this decision for yourself.

[mightysmurf8201]

I personally think I started selling too early. My 1st sale was my 4th pipe, and I've only made around 30. Although some of the early ones wouldn't leave my shop nowadays, I personally don't regret it because I see how much the recipients are still enjoying them, and in the end I'm happy with that. But it all goes back to who you're selling to and why you're selling. For now I'm happy catering to the less discerning pipe smoker who still appreciates a well made pipe. They like what I'm making, and it's helping me buy more tools and materials. Win/win. As I improve, things will probably change, but for now I'm satisfied. But like Chris said, it's a choice you have to make based on what you want out of it.

[Sasquatch]

Sell it. Sell it at a fair price, but go ahead and sell the damn things. Recoup 50 bucks out of it.

No one is going to confuse your second pipe for a masterpiece and bid $9000.00 on it on eBay. Early pipes are early pipes and everyone can see that.


No offense Sandahl, but you can't "Recoup" your reputation when you've been making pipes for 2 years. You don't have a reputation to recoup, it's impossible.

You build a reputation over time selling pipes that people like, given what they paid. Don't try to get 250 bucks out of an ugly lump. People know what they are doing. They aren't expecting a Nordh if you've been honest about your intentions and your skill level.

Get pipes out there, get feedback on how they smoke, how they feel, how shiny they stay.... all of it.

After ten years, you'll look at your 30th pipe and say "Wow I can't believe anyone bought that piece of shit." Draw the line somewhere and start selling them to people who want them. If someone comes back with a problem, fix it. It's easy, really.

[Tyler]

Sell it. Sell it at a fair price, but go ahead and sell the damn things. Recoup 50 bucks out of it.

No one is going to confuse your second pipe for a masterpiece and bid $9000.00 on it on eBay. Early pipes are early pipes and everyone can see that.


No offense Sandahl, but you can't "Recoup" your reputation when you've been making pipes for 2 years. You don't have a reputation to recoup, it's impossible.

You build a reputation over time selling pipes that people like, given what they paid. Don't try to get 250 bucks out of an ugly lump. People know what they are doing. They aren't expecting a Nordh if you've been honest about your intentions and your skill level.

Get pipes out there, get feedback on how they smoke, how they feel, how shiny they stay.... all of it.

After ten years, you'll look at your 30th pipe and say "Wow I can't believe anyone bought that piece of shit." Draw the line somewhere and start selling them to people who want them. If someone comes back with a problem, fix it. It's easy, really.

^^ This.

Don't over think it. As long as you sell for a fair price, you're fine. If you're not sure what a fair price is, show us a pic and ask.

Reputation, as we mean it in this thread, is an issue of price-to-quality alignment, not an issue of making perfect pipes.

[Ocelot55]

+1 for Sas and Tyler

One thing I made sure of however, was to change my nomenclature and purchase a stamp when I felt I had achieved a certain level of proficiency. That will separate your learning phase from works that are more recent or your most proud of.

But most of all, IMHO, you need to be priced appropriately. My first 10 pipes sold for under $60. Breaking the $100 and $200 marks were a big deal for me. I've still yet to break the $300 mark, but it's coming soon.

So sell, sell, sell! BUT: be fair on price, listen to your customers' feedback, and get some critique from the pros.

[Joe Hinkle Pipes]

I made pipes for 3 years before i started selling to the general public. Some people would say that is too long, but i just couldnt let them out with the problems i could see in them, even for $80. I had to get my pipes in the hands of other pipemakers and get their feedback on what was good, bad, unacceptable, or ugly Before i was comfortable selling the to "collectors". Im trying to build this slowly. i have seen (and continue to see) guys that are sellling totally ugly pipes with premold stems for a higher price than I ask for my pipes, but they wont be around in 3 years. As long as you sell for a fair price and give the customer plenty of photos on which they can base their decision i think you will be just fine.

[Tyler]

<snip> but they wont be around in 3 years. <snip>

You might be surprised.

Don't forget, we aren't just selling pipes. We are selling the experience they bring. Unpacking that is a a fully different thread.

[Joe Hinkle Pipes]

<snip> but they wont be around in 3 years. <snip>

You might be surprised.

Don't forget, we aren't just selling pipes. We are selling the experience they bring. Unpacking that is a a fully different thread.

Oh please, someone unpackage this! I would love to hear some of your opinions on the topic.

[sandahlpipe]

Thank you for correcting me, Tyler and Sas. Some of my early pipes shouldn't have been sold at any price. I still get embarrassed whenever one of my early customers shows me their pipe I made back then. I wish I had discovered and asked this forum early on, but didn't.

[scotties22]

I think the first pipe I sold was my 5th....I think. It was to a member of one of the forums I am on. He now has 3 of my pipes that he smokes quite a bit. I don't regret selling any pipe and even my first pipe has a place in my heart. I will never be embarrassed about a pipe that I make. They are all learning experiences and my past pipes, successes and failures alike, have made me the pipe maker I am today.....wouldn't chance a thing.

Sell them if you are comfortable with it. If not, ask them to pay for the materials and call it a day.

[d.huber]

<snip> but they wont be around in 3 years. <snip>

You might be surprised.

Don't forget, we aren't just selling pipes. We are selling the experience they bring. Unpacking that is a a fully different thread.

Oh please, someone unpackage this! I would love to hear some of your opinions on the topic.

I don't think it takes a lot of unpacking. What we tend to talk about here is pursuit based. When we ask for critique, we're trying to get better and better to learn and improve the product we're making. The thing that many of us forget, and something that Sas and Tyler have pointed out countless times before, is that Joe six pack buys a LOT of pipes. The pipes they buy are priced low, smoke well enough, and many (now) are hand made. Even if someone has shoddy shaping and use pre-mold stems on every pipe they make for 30 years, as long as they're priced correctly, they'll have steady sales. I can think of a few pipe makers who have done something like that who have been around forever and people love their pipes. They're not wrong to do so either. Those buyers and those makers simply have different priorities than what we tend to pursue on this forum. That doesn't mean those makers can't or won't be wildly successful. Actually, it's MORE likely that they'll be successful than we will because with pursuit comes a certain cost and fewer people are willing to pay the higher prices that we ask for more refined, precise work. The pursuit method just takes more time and patience.

I'm pretty sure my first sale was my 5th or 7th pipe (I still have my 6th). It was a blowfish and I sold it for $60. The guy was really happy with it.

If you do just what Tyler and Sas said, you shouldn't have anything to worry about.

[LatakiaLover]

If you do just what Tyler and Sas said, you shouldn't have anything to worry about.

That they share 13 feet and 500+ low-bodyfat pounds between them makes doing what they say a no-brainer as well.

[Sasquatch]

I'm big but Ty's the mean one.

Further Unpacking: I started making pipes when I realized that my lathe could turn a stem. Then I found a briar source - this was back in the days where maybe not everybody knew 5 cutters by name. We are talking pre-historic pipe making, way way back in like, 2008. This is before some of you were born. So I got some wood from PIMO I think, made a few ugly dogs, got some wood from Jaume Hom, from Tim West... the more things change, the more they stay the same. I'm selling ugly pipes to people with a "Hey, I'm making some pipes, hoping for like, sixty bucks, that'll include shipping." I am over-run with buyers. These are pipes I never want to see again. But the guys are mostly real happy with them.

I slowly evolve a brand, a stamp, a persona, actually. But purposely I never say anything good about my own pipes. I'll go the "mediterranean briar and German ebonite" road if I have to. Should be a good smoker. But that's it. My pipes are an exercise in NON-branding - there's no secret handshake, no nod-and-wink Dunhill "verygoodsir!" routine at all. Here's your fucking pipe, wrapped in fucking bubble wrap. Now they are 100 whole dollars!

At some point, I realize this thing IS a brand, the Sasquatch is a very real and to some people important signpost in the virtual pipe world. The pipes a living extension of my love for carving and for the gentle art of smoking a pipe. My presence is ubiquitous, I am a carver (wannabe), historian (wannabe), mentor (wannabe)... I am many things to many people. The pipes are getting better and better, slower than I might like but sales are strong - Joe Sixpack buys a LOT of fucking pipes. Come a website, come a pipe show.... all these little things adding up to me being the next big thing in pipes, except I'm not, because a) I probably outright just don't have the talent b) I make a lot more money at decks and fences and c) I'm totally not sure I want to HAVE to do my passion, my fun, for my living. So I scale it all back. Go from 50 pipes a year to like, 10 or 20. These are now 300 dollar pipes, sales still strong, and that's where I'm at. I make pipes people seem to want. They smoke good, just as good as Abe's, Wayne's, Tyler's, Premal's... whoever. As good as a Dunhill, Castello. It's the easy part. The other part is the brand - who you are, what the pipes represent to the people who buy them. I mean, there's a forum where if you don't have one of my pipes, you're sort of not in the club, you know, and I never aimed at that, I never dreamed that that would be the case. It's really flattering. And ... the pipes are all right. But it's the package, the experience as well.

So while an ugly poor pipe is an ugly poor pipe, and a really beautiful well done pipe will sell itself, you also have to be very cognizant that to a lot of your customers, the stamp, the grade, the mood you were in, the temperature that day you made the pipe - this is all special shit to them. This is what they DON'T get from Stanwell (and in truth, Stanwell at one point made better stems than most of us and had better wood than most of us!).

The fucking HOURS of emails and phone calls about pipes..... holy shit I've wasted George's time, Tyler's, Andrew's, Nate's... I've got email threads with customers where we have both sent upwards of 80 emails before I ship a pipe. It's insane. And it's what makes this magic for the people involved.

So there's your unpack.










These pipes are out there man.... they represent a guy working with like, 2 blocks of briar left, hoping he doesn't misdrill something.... trading for tobacco or a little cash or just good will.... this is the history of me as a pipemaker, I'm not ashamed I'm not Bo Nordh.

The other day I banged out this thing for a guy who basically said "make it wicked".


And maybe next year I'll hate it, or maybe Lars Ivarsson laughs at that. I don't give a shit. I hope the guy smokes it till it's a crumpled up fucking cinder.

[LatakiaLover]

I've got email threads with customers where we have both sent upwards of 80 emails before I ship a pipe. It's insane.

Ah... the portion of the time-iceberg that lies beneath the waterline for all new(ish) pipe makers and repairmen. Track and add those typing & talking hours to your shop ones if you want to cry when doing your books.

The good news is that over time more and more customers just say, "Do that thing you do" and stand back, knowing they'll be happy.

[Joe Hinkle Pipes]

Todd,
That wasn't what i thought I was looking for, but it was EXACTLY what i was looking for. If you love making pipes, who cares if you sit at $100 for the next 10 years, you will always have a client base that is waiting for your next $100 billiard. I guess the process IS magical for the guy on the receiving end. They love progress shots and updates, they want to know how you cut a stem. Its a story and a connection between the maker and the smoker. There is nothing better than that email you get when the customer says they love the pipe and they are putting the 7th bowl through it that day. This is so much more rewarding that working a 9-5.

[Sasquatch]

It is rewarding, it's deep fun.

At some point, you will probably say "This isn't a hundred dollar pipe, it's a goddam 125 dollar pipe!" and then 200 and then 300... at some point that little critter in your mind will say "My time is worth more than this" and when it does, you go for the next tier. And if you are happy at any particular level... yeah, shit, that's okay. There's a strong unspoken obligation in this community that making high grade pipes OUGHT to be the goal and I've fought that forever. The goal is whatever the hell you like. Make 1000 pipes a year and give them to needy lesbian pipe smokers. Whatever. Make 10 pipes a year that are nicer than Bo Nordh's. Great. It's all good. And yeah, if you want to make your living as a pipe maker, there's probably certain goals to strive for, but most of us have the luxury of being able to do this at our own pace, for our own reasons, and find our own style of success.