Best starting point for rough shaping

[Dixie_piper]

I've noticed a few different ways to get the rough shaping started on here, just wondering if my thinking is correct here;
1) square the block
2) draw the pipe on the side of the block
3) cut the basic outline through the width of the block with the bandsaw

I've read posts that likewise spoke ill of using the bandsaw, so what are the downsides of thi method (minus the wandering blade from a lack of width, etc)?
Reason for asking is I'm currently using a hacksaw for rough shaping, and the results are sufficient somewhat, but very time consuming, and often times difficult to keep semi-straight cuts. I'm considering the purchase of a reasonable band saw, mainly because I need it more so than other power tools for other projects, and it's within reach of my current "pipe funds"
Thanks in advance for any input!

[Tyler]

I've noticed a few different ways to get the rough shaping started on here, just wondering if my thinking is correct here;
1) square the block
2) draw the pipe on the side of the block
3) cut the basic outline through the width of the block with the bandsaw

I've read posts that likewise spoke ill of using the bandsaw, so what are the downsides of thi method (minus the wandering blade from a lack of width, etc)?
Reason for asking is I'm currently using a hacksaw for rough shaping, and the results are sufficient somewhat, but very time consuming, and often times difficult to keep semi-straight cuts. I'm considering the purchase of a reasonable band saw, mainly because I need it more so than other power tools for other projects, and it's within reach of my current "pipe funds"
Thanks in advance for any input!

You're over thinking this whole thing.

Best way to start, is to start. Just make a pipe, then do better the next time.

Tyler

P.S. Whoever spoke ill of the bandsaw was over thinking this whole thing too. It's just a saw. The difference between a bandsaw and a hacksaw is speed.

[Dixie_piper]

My apologies then for asking yet another stupid question. I was just noticing that it SEEMS that it would be easier to follow the initial layout with the bandsaw, and given the experience of the makers here on the board, I was hoping someone would elaborate the down side of the bandsaw or point out some aspect I've over looked.
But you're right, I'll put the dunce cap on and go stick my nose in the corner.

[Mike Messer]

You can also use a coping saw to do the rough cut-out. They only cost about $5 to $20, but tend to drift a bit and are slow. Bandsaws are best for the cut-out. After you cut the side profile, then redraw the shank on top of the block, and cut it out. In both cases I draw bigger than the pipe, about 1/8 inch in each direction.

[KurtHuhn]

You're over thinking this whole thing.

Best way to start, is to start. Just make a pipe, then do better the next time.

Tyler beat me to it. Again.

The best place to start is by by doing it. There are no rules, and there's no need to get stressed about it.

Start where you are comfortable, and move from there.

If cutting the profile on a bandsaw is comfortable, by all means do so. I almost never do. I tend to make a lot of dust on the shaping wheel and belt grinder. That reminds me, I need to empty the dust collector bags...

[RadDavis]

Using a bandsaw is fine. I cut every pipe on the bandsaw first. Just don't try to get a lot of detail with it.

Rad

[Sasquatch]

I use a bandsaw. It is better than a coping saw because I do not swear at it as much and God is much happier with my pipes because of this.

Unlike Rad, I do all my shaping on the bandsaw, and then sand with 320.

[Dixie_piper]

Thanks fellas!
I'm still gettin a feel for the infant stage processes.
@ Mike; I've tried the coping saw, I think mine is better suited for things like... butter! And as you said, blade wander is horrid with that thing. Thanks!
@ Kurt; Another good point, it sucks being an indecisive as the day is long! I'll keep at what I've got for now, until I get my hads on 2 more tools that will definitely speed things up a bit
@ Rad; that's the first mistake I made, cutting the shank "flush," with where I wanted the top to be...... not such good results,
I think that was the point in the posts I had read on here, that someone wanted to basically go from the saw to 220 grit by hand.
@ Sas; in all honesty the "less sweat" thing has a pull in this too, lol. It's a lil antagonizing to spend forever hackin away only to realize "hmm... at some point this should start to resemble a pipe" No pain no gain I reckon.
Thanks again fellas!

[Tyler]

My apologies then for asking yet another stupid question. I was just noticing that it SEEMS that it would be easier to follow the initial layout with the bandsaw, and given the experience of the makers here on the board, I was hoping someone would elaborate the down side of the bandsaw or point out some aspect I've over looked.
But you're right, I'll put the dunce cap on and go stick my nose in the corner.

You don't need to apologize.

I realize that my answer was a little short, but I think it was helpful. The best way to learn about pipe making is to make pipes. My intent with my post was not to be rude, but to be clear.

There is no downside to a bandsaw.

Tyler

[TimGeorge]

I use this one. $97 bucks and it works great (for pipemaking at least):

http://www.amazon.com/Factory-Reconditi ... B001V9K69E

[SimeonTurner]

The only thing to be aware of with a bandsaw (other than making sure your fingers stay away from the blade) is that it's easy to get all cocky and feel like you can cut the profile really tightly. If you do this, there is a good chance that you over cut and end up with saw tooth marks deeper than you'd like. This is especially true right in the intersection between the bowl and the shank.

My rule of thumb is to cut the profile a good 1/4" to 1/2" wider than it is actually drawn on the block. that way, while there's a little bit more sanding to do, there's less cursing due to needed to alter your shape due to overzealous cutting.

But really, Tyler's right. just go make some pipes and you will quickly answer these sorts of questions for yourself, and the lessons learned will stick a lot more.

[Dixie_piper]

Thanks fellas!
@ Tyler, no worries, I completely get the point of "just o it," that's been my employers training method for years now It does work, and lessons learned tend to stick
@ TimGeorge, I've looked at that band saw as an option, may go with one having a deeper cut in the event I should need it, thanks though, glad to hear good things about it
@ Simeon, thanks, that's pretty much the anwer I was looking for. I'll definitely be keeping an eye out for finger loss The general "overcut" was especially helpful, thanks

[MadTinker]

Man I use a bunch of Clamps, a Handheld Jigsaw then my 4" Angle Grinder. Lots O dust but I grind metal all day so whats a little Wood Dust.....

[ToddJohnson]

I don't like cutting the shape out in two dimensions because it drastically limits your shaping possibilities. I think I've mentioned this before in reference to shaping first and drilling by hand. This may be what Dixie is referring to. Grinding your way through the entire block will give you a more intimate knowledge of it and help you make better decisions about whether or not to chase pits, etc. This, however, is a different form of pipemaking. If you're working from a template and that's what you're going to make either way, then yes, the bandsaw will make things much faster. At the end of the day, though, you just need to start removing wood by whatever means you have available to you.

TJ

[Sasquatch]

Shaping first and drilling second is just a way for an inexperienced pipe maker to make ugly pipes more slowly, Todd.

There is something to learn about reading briar, and I understand the very best pipes in terms of graining are shaped first, but there's small point in attempting this as a newbie imho (and I realize you are not suggesting such, TJ).

[Dixie_piper]

@ TJ; I actually started 2 stummels, 1 with a template, 1 with only a general idea. The template, screwed me all up, way too big and goofy looking. The one without the template, came along nicely. So I'll most likely still trim away the extreme excess by saw, but in a 3 dimensonal way like I started on these 2, after drilling. I did get to "chase a crack" on both blocks, which helped salvage what I'd originally thought to be a F.U.B.A.R. Your comment about sanding through to get more familiar with the briar does make sense, and I'll most likely spend more time at the wheel on my next stummel
@ Sasquatch (the other Todd ) I do plan to keep drilling first, God only knows what I'd scrub up without doing that first.
My reason for asking about the bandsaw was mainly to avoid whatever pitfall I may have overlooked. I don't find such tools a "necessity," but they can speed certain processes along. The files and rasps work wonderfully, a bit tedious at times, but much more control.