Commission Fees?

[flix]

Hi All,

Just posted in the finish forum. I have a dress black pipe that I need to generate a quote for. I'm not sure how much.

I've made around 30 pipes so far, sold about half of them. Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,

--Michael

[KurtHuhn]

Trever has posted some excellent advice on this in the past. Buggered if I can find the post though. It was basically a warning to be sure to cover your time so that you don't end up working for minimum wage. The biggest part of this is knowing how long it takes you to perform a given task on a pipe, and how long it should take you to reach a finished product. Add to that the time you spend marketing yourself, updating your website (and associated hosting fees), and getting your products out there.

Also, keep in mind that it's easier to offer for a lower price now and raise prices later as your reputation and skill increase, than it is to set your prices too high now, and have to lower them in order to move product.

[flix]

Thanks, Kurt, for the response.

I wish I could find that Talbert post also.

I did get a budget top limit of $400 from the customer, paid on time basis, not all at once. I think that's too much for someone of my experience. So, I thought I should charge him $250, with lifetime finish warranty. Meaning that if the finish gets dull or wears off, I'll re-do it for free, incl. shipping.

I can't think of a more reasonable price for such a time intensive piece.

I value your opinions, please let me know what you all think.

Thanks

--Michael

[Tyler]

I'll toss in my thoughts.

I don't think time is a good way to price a pipe. If you spend 23 hours on what turns out to be a piece of crap, it is not worth more than a pipe that is gorgeous and took Tom Eltang 2 hours to make.

Since I don't know what comments for Trever are being referenced, I won't speculate on what he said. What I will do is say that if you can't make a pipe that is worth more than minimum wage time-wise then you need to do some evaluating. If you are willing to make $1.32 an hour, press on! If you are not willing to make that, then you need to find something else to do. (Of course, one option is to get a lot better at pipe making.) This is especially pertinent for those that are considering pipe making as a vocation. Since this is a hobby for most of us, heck, making ANY money on a hobby is pretty cool. Most hobbies cost out the nose. By contrast, if you need to make pipe making a viable source of income you need to factor in costs and time -v- income, like any business. This evaluation does not determine what you CAN GET from the pipe, it determines what you NEED TO GET from the pipe. Unfortunately I suspect that most people would be surprised at the prices they would NEED TO GET, and I also think that very few people can make pipes good enough make those two numbers match. (FWIW, it is surprising the number of famous pipe makers who have secondary sources of income upon which they rely such as spouses that work full-time at something other than pipes, disability income, etc..)

More specifically to your question about the black dress finish pipe, I'd suggest it is impossible to fairly quote a price ahead of time. You might get killed on it since you don't know what the briar might bring. If you keep hitting pits, are you in the position to make 8 of these pipes to hit a smooth one? Are you willing to fill since this will be black? Is your customer willing to have pits? fills? wait for the 8th try?

I'd suggest quoting a price range. You could say your price will be between X and Y depending on what the wood gives. That might not work for your customer though if the range is too big.

I could go on and on with all the pitfalls, but I'm tired of typing.

Let me sum up: I didn't take commissioned work. It's too much of a pain in the neck. And I most definitely would never quote a firm price on a commission before beginning work. That said, plenty of guys take commissions, so take my comments for the cost you paid for them.



Tyler

[Tyler]

Oh, a comment on the "lifetime" deal. Do you really want to commit yourself to that? On some level, in order to keep your word, that promise implies that you will never stop working with pipes.

If someone ever has a problem with a pipe I made, I will do whatever I can to make it right, even though I quit the pipe biz 2 years ago. That said, I am so glad I never promised dozens of customers a lifetime anything. My word has not obligated me to work on pipes even though I have quit the biz. (BTW, I NEVER would have guessed I would have quit selling pipes. I loved almost every second of it. Priorities cause us to make tough choices though, and I am very glad I was not permanently tethered to something such that I could not quit it.)

More free thoughts.


Tyler

[KurtHuhn]

I don't think time is a good way to price a pipe. If you spend 23 hours on what turns out to be a piece of crap, it is not worth more than a pipe that is gorgeous and took Tom Eltang 2 hours to make.

Exactly! I think the gist of Trever's post was that you need to be able to make a good pipe for the price you can command without ending up making minimum wage. Basically, if all you can sell are $100 pipes, and it takes you 8 hours to make one, you really need to improve on your process.

I really need to fix the search function. No idea why it's all busticated - I even reindexed the database.