Maximum yeild from a given space

Discussions on growing and cultivating tobacco.
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Daniel Y
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:21 pm
Location: Reno, NV

Maximum yeild from a given space

Post by Daniel Y »

Hello folks. I just ordered my first tobacco seeds fro the seedman yesterday. I also discovered the forum growyourowntobacco.com and applied to be a member. So far it has not been approved so I am not able to post this there.

This post is on a subject I have not seen yet anywhere so I want to do a little background explaining first.
My thinking is grounded in the concept of square foot gardening. which in a nut shell is not a technique to yield max harvest per plant, but to yield max harvest from a given space.

Here is an example. a plot 10 feet by 10 feet is 100 square feet. By following the spacing recommendations for tobacco that I have most commonly found of 2 feet between plants this allows a maximum of 25 (each plant requires 4 sq feet) plants in that space. If each plant produces 4 oz of smokable tobacco you will get 100 oz of tobacco per 100 sq feet.

If you halved ed the space between plants to just one foot you can plant 100 plants in that space but you stunt them. I read one comment that stated plants could be spaced as close as 20 inches apart without noticing any effect on the plants development. so I am pushing that by another 8 inches just as an example. without knowing just how much you could stress a tobacco plant before outright killing it (0 yield) I will assume that crowding plants to 12 inch spacing will stunt it by 50% or each plant will only produce 2 ounces of smokable tobacco. even with greatly stunted plants your yield is 200 oz of tobacco per 100 sq feet. In effect you double your harvest by not growing your pants in optimum space.

I know for a fact these techniques work and that the increase in harvest is actually much higher (the effect on plants is much lower) than might be expected with many other common garden plants. Radishes, beets, onions, carrots and other root crops grown in 4 sq inches of ground. Tomatoes grown in a square foot of ground (Although they are pruned and trained) corn grown in one q foot even watermelon and other melons growing in a square foot of ground. I have personal experience at growing all the above

My questions is. Has anyone done any experimenting on just how much you can crowed tobacco, and what where the results of those attempts?

Finally, I also discovered the whole thing where the gov is offering free seeds for doing research. And yes i saw where the gov also caught on to a lot of their requests going to back yard growers. But in this case this really would be research. I am thinking of trying to find multiple participants that would be willing to plant a yet to be determined number of plants at various spacings 12, 14, 16, 18, and 20 inches apart. and log the results on regard to inches of growth per week, and final yield.

In short test the idea and how far can tobacco really be pushed and what the results might be across a wide variety of tobaccos. I really want to test them to the point they are killed due to crowding so the limit is known for as many varieties as possible.

I have seen some indications already that plants can be crowded far more than is typical. the number one example is how crowded they become in almost every instance of being started. roughly 6 inch tall or larger plants in flats growing in 4 sq inches of soil. Yet they are thriving. I have also seen in one example that this is about the limit. the plants will actually stop growing if left in that condition. but moving a 6 inch plant from 4 square inches to a proposed 144 sq inches is a big increase in space.

I know many of your actually use Acad drawing to lay out your plant spacing to maximize number of plants in your garden. what have you all discovered is the point that you start stunting the full growth of your plants? So far I have that distance in my head at 20 inches.

thanks for any input you have about your experiences. any info at all will help be set some perimeters as to where to start.
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KurtHuhn
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Re: Maximum yeild from a given space

Post by KurtHuhn »

That's a pretty interesting line of thought. I think one facet to explore is the quality of the yield - the sugar content, flavor, etc. I'm not sure how that would be measured by a home grower, since a lot of it is subjective, and everything you grow on your own seems to taste better anyway. :)

It sounds like a cool experiment. I've got some garden space I can donate to the cause, as well as seeds of a few different varieties. Actually, I have enough garden space for both experiment and control plants, removing environmental factors.
Kurt Huhn
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Daniel Y
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:21 pm
Location: Reno, NV

Re: Maximum yeild from a given space

Post by Daniel Y »

Kurt, factors that might effect the quality of the finished product are far to many to try and track with any test of this sort. that issue would simply have to be a matter of the growers opinion. since that is all that really matters anyway it is not a huge consolation. Anyone with experience in growing there own tobacco already knows what their results have been, and would be the most qualified to know if the test made a difference. Although determining why there is a difference would be a guessing game at best. the grower would be the most qualified to have a semi educated guess.

I appreciate your willingness to take part in this experiment. the more the better and the more accurate the results will be.

I will share with you what I intend to do.

I do not know just yet what variety of tobacco i will use in my tests. I have a full flavor cigarette tobacco assortment coming from seedman. I do not know exactly what is in that assortment. btu once it arrives I will pick one variety as my test.

I am going to dedicate 9 plants to each test and plant a patch at each spacing listed above in a 3x3 grid. this causes one plant to be completely surrounded. it is that one plant I will watch like a hawk for the most accurate results.

For this test I am only going to log weekly growth in inches of all 9 plants as well as there location. the squares will be labeled N, NE,E,SE,S,SW,W,NW and C (center). I assume you can all guess what those mean. this also makes the test relevant to anyone on the planet

C will be the only plant that is actually completely crowded and would be the only plant that exhibits the effects of the spacing restrictions.

So in all I will have 5 grids of 9 plants each for a total of 45 plants devoted to the experiment. I honestly wish i had room to do multiple or larger test grids but i simply do not. this is actually giving up a lot of my space already considering I only have room for 160 plants the way it is. I am going to use other (continuous harvest) techniques to maximize my total production.

I am going to do nothing more than log any observations i fell are relevant and specifically measure plant growth each week.

This sort of growing does not work for large scale as it requires to much individual care of the plants.

If you do any tests of your own, let me know what variety you use haw many plants and how they are configured spaced etc. other than that all I am looking for is a weekly log of plant growth. this is by no means showing the whole story. I don't expect it to.
Daniel Y
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:21 pm
Location: Reno, NV

Re: Maximum yeild from a given space

Post by Daniel Y »

Here is a bit more info I found on the growing tobacco site. A post was made by someone that mistakenly planted !!!4!!! plants all in the same spot. He was a new grower so his opinion of the results would be suspect simply because of lack of experience. His spacing was already only 18 inches for the rest of the garden. He transplanted these outdoors to one hole when they where 15 inches tall. He then said that they where all thriving after 2 months but the leaves where on the smallish side. It was later added that the plants where a Virginia.

One reply that sounded like it came from someone that has been at this for a while mentioned that narrow thin unsmokable leaves are a result of crowding. At the vary least this would never work for a person growing leaves for cigars. This is a very extreme case though and shows that even excessive crowding does not result in tremendous stunting or even death but that the plants still "thrive" well take that thriving comment with a bent toward suspicion.

One other post in that thread outright stated that 1. Virginia strains are known to tolerate crowding while some other varieties of tobacco do not do so well. and
2. that traditional spacing has more to do with ease of tending the plants than the needs of them.

At any rate his is at least one report that indicates that an entire garden of multiple varieties preformed without any issues with an 18 inch plant spacing and one small indication that stacking them all in one whole they will still live and grow.
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